First, find out what isn't true…

June 7, 2010

AMAZING Mavi Marmara “weapons cache” discovery! A few suspect knives and slingshots.


(Adding information as the IDF story unfolds (sic) ) It is unfolding, in fact it’s falling to pieces.

06/04/2010 06:13 “the group they were facing was well-trained and likely ex-military after the commandos threw a number of stun grenades and fired warning shots before rappelling down onto the deck. “They didn’t even flinch,” he said. “Regular people would move.” “


Weird Paintball gun!


On careful reading, Israel was within it’s rights to intercept. San Remo Manual on International Law Applicable to Armed Conflicts at Sea, 12 June 1994

However the nature of the intercept begs a few questions and the Israeli justifications are as full of holes as they are bizarre.

The Israeli’s claim the rappelling personnel wore asbestos gloves, making it impossible to use their weapons. Never heard of asbestos gloves in rappelling. One needs to be able to feel the rope, a light LEATHER glove is sometimes used so that the rope can be felt through the glove. Most folk’ll tell you it’s better to have full feel of the rope, no gloves at all. ( your life is in your hands, if you can’t feel the rope, it’s dangerous )

The rappelling rope passes through a figure 8 or belay device. A figure 8 twists the rope, because of the ‘lay’ of the internal fibres, eventually forming kinks/knots, same as an electrical extension cord develops knots when not rolled up using the ‘under over’ method

Modern military rappells on a rope usually use a belaying Device (BDs). Small, light weight, can be easily released, does not twist the rope, requires minimal hand pressure. I’ve used BDs & figure 8 AND taken photos/video, mid air, using my free hand and I’m no expert. In fact not at all fond of swing around on a rope mid air.

However looking closely at the video available, it seems they’re using a ‘silk’ rather than a rope as it varies in thickness. A ‘silk’ is a long length of cloth used by circus and burlesque performers.

The NY Times reports that the use of plastic/rubber bullets was planned and WERE fired from above.. “The crack of an Israeli sound grenade and a hail of rubber bullets from above were supposed to disperse activists, but instead set them in motion. ”

So again it seems the Israeli bullshit vendors have been busy at work..LYING….. again! One needs to double check ANYTHING put out by Israel concerning the Palestinians. They LIE and LIE and LIE again.

The some of the weapons seized – life threatening pepper spray Personal Pak

Giant knife :-) What a cutie. No doubt sharper but not as efficient as a bullet fired from out of the tiny knife’s reach

Israeli Govt website tries to show an alleged “Weapons Cache”
ShipBoard TOOLS
For the most part, they look like tools found on any ship. An axe is a tool on a ship. They’re in EVERY fire cabinet. A knife is a tool on a ship. Every sailor has one. The galley has heaps of knives. A hammer is a tool on a ship. So is a spanner. All ships carry sticks, (wood), broom handles, steel rods and pipes, ropes, cables, chain, angle grinders. It’s quite NORMAL ON A SHIP…FFS!! When you’re at sea you cannot just call into a hardware store.

The “weapons cache” seems to be nothing more than a few suspect knives and sling shots and

a ceremonial dagger used by the Imam in prayer meetings. Photo by a passenger, PRIOR to the intercept? Unless of course the IDF made him pose…Likely? No! Forgery? Looks like it

More on the dagger – cloning around for Israel

More Israeli BULLSHIT… From the Israeli Government web site “Flotilla leaders stated violence was premeditated”

What was QUOTED and what was actually said “We will definitely resist and we will not allow the Israelis to enter here.”….actually….“If Israel wants to board this ship, it will meet strong resistance. “

Hasn’t Israel ever heard of passive resistance and why does Israel need to lie?

Comments are closed. If you don’t get it from the existing comments, you’ll never get it


  1. Thanks, I understand better. In fact, a lot of confusion comes from the fact that Israel’s govt is treating Hamas like a state or elected government when it suits them (to wage war), but like an “obstruction” to the establishment of a state when it is useful. It’s all very ambiguous.

    Comment by Rob — June 19, 2010 @ 2:53 am

    • It’s a mess.

      Quite. Do not take ANYTHING Israel says in regards to the Palestinians at face value. It’s aimed only at justifying Israel’s usurping the Palestinians, on behalf of a Greater Israel. They will never be convinced, no matter how well an argument is presented. It would mean life times of indoctrination unraveling. It’s awful hard to admit you’ve believed a lie all your life.

      All one can do is show things as they are and/or were, in the hope that other folk will have a better understanding in order to collectively counter the ghastly Hasbara propaganda.

      Comment by talknic — June 19, 2010 @ 4:46 am

  2. Hello again,
    Now I remember what I wanted to ask :

    The Hamas Charter, written in 1988 is another big hasbara talking point – I have often responded that it is no longer relevant, that many members and officials in Hamas are even unaware of most of its text. However, some say that as a “charter”, it needs to actually be renounced “formally” in order to lose its validity as the founding document. It is hard to find much information on this on the web, and it seems to me that they drag this out whenever it’s useful to bash Hamas, and it smells like bullshit, but I have no definitive response to the question.

    Thanks again

    Comment by Rob — June 15, 2010 @ 11:59 pm

    • Hi Rob,

      Ask ’em if they read the WHOLE contract before they sign their mortgage loan.

      The Hamas Charter was A) written AFTER Israel illegally claimed territories NOT slated for the Jewish state. It was written in response to Israel’s illegal actions which dispossessed hundreds of thousands of non-Jewish people.

      B) It has a caveat. Article Thirty-One: “As to those who have not borne arms against you on account of religion, nor turned you out of your dwellings, Allah forbiddeth you not to deal kindly with them, and to behave justly towards them; for Allah loveth those who act justly.” (The Tried – verse 8).

      Further more, Hamas is a political party it cannot Declare Sovereignty on behalf of the Palestinians. Individual political parties do not represent the will of all the people in an entity.

      A good example – The Jewish People’s Council, a non-political organization declaring for all the people, regardless of their political persuasion, which exists only until a Government OF THE STATE has been elected.

      Only AFTER there is a state, can there be a Government of the State, whose Charter and/or Constitution is relevant.

      The Hamas Charter has A) a caveat. Lukid’s Charter does not. B) The Hamas charter is irrelevant in respect to what the new state’s elected Government might be and C) what recognition it might afford to Israel. If it wishes, there is no legal obligation.

      Given the reasons Hamas was originally formed, once the Palestinians have a state it might disappear completely.

      They’re scaremongering, speculating by cherry picking a document written in war, for war by a people dispossessed by war.

      Comment by talknic — June 17, 2010 @ 9:30 pm

  3. Thanks, you’re a chief.

    Comment by Rob — June 11, 2010 @ 11:43 am

  4. Hi Rob,

    There’s a few ways of answering TO the question :-)

    Short retort – “Why TF would anyone want to buy land in a territory where folk just want to kill them? Unless they have an ulterior motive, they’d be nuts! So tell me, why do they want to buy this land?”

    Shorter retort – “Can a non Israeli Palestinian buy land in Israel?”

    Even shorter retort – “Who is selling, Israel or a Palestinian?”

    Even shorter short retort – Un-publishable…


    But seriously though folks…In respect to Palestinians selling real estate, I have no doubt they’d be reticent to sell land to anyone from a hostile state, especially one that has illegally usurped them from some 50% of their rightful territories since becoming a peace loving neighbour 62 years ago.

    Never the less, the answer will be in existing Palestinian Legislation or in proposed legislation for the proposed state. Anything else is hearsay. Might take a while … we could dig around here as a starting point. I’ll have a dig later.


    Meanwhile, the West Bank is under Military Occupation and the laws governing Military occupation. East Jerusalem is illegally annexed. It too actually falls into the same category, as do any non-annexed territories Israel illegally claims beyond it’s declared sovereign boundaries.

    Laws of War Art. 55. “The occupying State shall be regarded only as administrator and usufructuary of public buildings, real estate, forests, and agricultural estates belonging to the hostile State, and situated in the occupied country. It must safeguard the capital of these properties, and administer them in accordance with the rules of usufruct.”

    It is illegal for Israel to sell any occupied land to anyone. It isn’t Israel’s. It can only administer the sale of real estate on behalf of the occupied.


    I’ll get back to this


    Comment by talknic — June 10, 2010 @ 11:27 pm

  5. Hello Talknic,
    I saw your comments on the Mondoweiss site.
    I have two questions you might be able to answer briefly for me (I haven’t been able to find much on them in my searches), if you could be so kind to be bothered with it :

    1. Can Jews or Israelis acquire property in the WB legally, or is there a law against it currently? (notwithstanding the illegal settler land grab, which obviously renders the “legal” question a little irrelevant) I would like to respond to this talking point with a definitive response, or, more importantly, know if it even makes sense to ask the question.

    2. I forgot, I may ask later!

    PS, your site is invaluable for those combating propaganda. It makes me think of Baillargeon’s “A Short Course in Intellectual Self-Defense”

    Comment by Rob — June 10, 2010 @ 9:50 pm

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